2006 Sonata hits 10,000 miles - a few observations

  • Thread starter Thread starter Matt Whiting
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Matt Whiting

My Sonata rolled over 10K on Friday so today was oil change and tire
rotation day. A few observations and comments:

1. The care has been very trouble-free during this time. I've really
only had one issue that required a visit to dealer (the noise in the
dash over sharp bumps), but that remains unresolved as I was unable to
reproduce it with the tech in the car. And it is less pronounced and
largely nonexistent in warm weather so I'll try again in January.

2. My overal fuel mileage is 29.30 MPG.

3. The front wheels were hard to remove, with the driver's side front
being very hard to remove. I had to beat on it for several minutes with
a hard polymer head hammer. I was about to get out my 5 lb. sledge when
it finally broke free. I've never had this problem with a car before.
I brushed grease on the flanges to avoid some of the rust in the future.
I've never had a car where the flange protruded so far through the
wheel hub hole.

4. Another first for me ... the oil filter gasket didn't come off with
the oil filter. I didn't notice this when I pulled off the filter as I
immediately turned it upside down and let it drain into the pan.
Fortunately, I always wipe the gasket flange with a paper towel before
installing the new filter. The old gasket came off with the paper
towel. I'm really glad it came off! I've changed my own oil for 30+
years using a wide range of filters, including early on the now infamous
Fram filters, and I've NEVER had this happen. Makes me question the
quality of Hyundai brand filters. The gasket is differently shaped than
most other filters and it appears to not be crimped in very well.
Anyone else have this happen?

5. The OEM Michelins appear to be wearing very fast. I typically get
60,000 miles given my driving style and regimen, but it appears that
nearly half the tread on the front tires is gone after only 10,000. The
wear is quite even so I don't suspect misalignment, but I suppose that
is possible.

I'm now ready for my second 10,000 miles, except I've got to check the
AC filter as that also calls for inspection/replacement at 10K as I recall.

Matt
 
4. Another first for me ... the oil filter gasket didn't come off with
the oil filter. I didn't notice this when I pulled off the filter as I
immediately turned it upside down and let it drain into the pan.
Fortunately, I always wipe the gasket flange with a paper towel before
installing the new filter. The old gasket came off with the paper
towel. I'm really glad it came off! I've changed my own oil for 30+
years using a wide range of filters, including early on the now infamous
Fram filters, and I've NEVER had this happen. Makes me question the
quality of Hyundai brand filters. The gasket is differently shaped than
most other filters and it appears to not be crimped in very well.
Anyone else have this happen?
Click to expand...

I have had this happen to me one time in my life Matt. I don't remember
what type of filter it was though. I don't worry much about this kind of
thing though. If the gasket is doing its job there will be no leaks and
that's all that it is there for. If it does not come off with the filter,
then that does become something I have to watch for in changing the filter,
but not something that concerns me at all from a functionality standpoint.
I would not find this to be a quality concern.
 
Mike said:
I have had this happen to me one time in my life Matt. I don't remember
what type of filter it was though. I don't worry much about this kind of
thing though. If the gasket is doing its job there will be no leaks and
that's all that it is there for. If it does not come off with the filter,
then that does become something I have to watch for in changing the filter,
but not something that concerns me at all from a functionality standpoint.
I would not find this to be a quality concern.
Click to expand...

I always wipe the flange so I should always catch this, but the fact
that the gasket comes off of the filter at removal is a quality issue to
me. The part isn't designed to do that, and anything it does that
violates the design intent is a part failure. And it greatly increases
the chance that a new filter will get put on top of an old gasket and
that will almost guarantee a serious oil leak. The hope then is that it
gets caught in time.

I agree it doesn't affect the functionality of the filter that lost the
gasket, but it may affect the functionality of the next filter if this
isn't discovered. It is a failure and thus a quality lapse. I'm
curious now to see how often this happens. If it happens again, I'll
switch to NAPA or another filter brand whose quality I trust. But I
have a whole case of Hyundai filters so that will be a while, lost
gaskets or not!


Matt
 
Matt, Glad you are enjoying the Sonata. Great fuel economy -- I
somewhat regreat not buying the inline four GLS. A thought about the
unsolved dash rattle you mention. I had a similar one that took some
time to locate. Mine sounded like it originated in the glovebox area.
Turns out it was the wood/black trim running across the dash (divides
the top and bottom colors). It was not properly seated (most likely
when an audio installer pulled the head unit to connect an amp). This
piece is accessed/removed with screws visible when the glovebox is
open.

I'm surprised to hear your Michelins are wearing quickly. Michelin
Energy tires are known to be fairly hard and long-lived. It's a good
idea to report it to your dealer and have them check the alignment.

GeoUSA, moderator http://www.hyundaiexchange.com
 
I'm surprised to hear your Michelins are wearing quickly. Michelin
Energy tires are known to be fairly hard and long-lived. It's a good
idea to report it to your dealer and have them check the alignment.
Click to expand...

These tires are rated high, but always wear fast. I can't find too many
people that managed to get the expected wear out of them. This is my third
car with them and I've had to replace them at between 20-25K miles on all.
Mind you, they were't worn out at that mileage, but once you hit 1/2 of the
tread life on just about any Michelin, you will notice a dramatic decrease
in traction, especially in the rain or snow.

Eric
 
GeoUSA said:
Matt, Glad you are enjoying the Sonata. Great fuel economy -- I
somewhat regreat not buying the inline four GLS. A thought about the
unsolved dash rattle you mention. I had a similar one that took some
time to locate. Mine sounded like it originated in the glovebox area.
Turns out it was the wood/black trim running across the dash (divides
the top and bottom colors). It was not properly seated (most likely
when an audio installer pulled the head unit to connect an amp). This
piece is accessed/removed with screws visible when the glovebox is
open.
Click to expand...

Mine sounds like it is coming from the glovebox also so it may be the
same thing. I plan to have the dealer take a look at it again this
winter when it happens more repeatably.

I'm surprised to hear your Michelins are wearing quickly. Michelin
Energy tires are known to be fairly hard and long-lived. It's a good
idea to report it to your dealer and have them check the alignment.
Click to expand...

Yes, I'm surprised also as I've had exceptional mileage in the past from
Michelins.

Matt
 
Eric said:
@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:




These tires are rated high, but always wear fast. I can't find too many
people that managed to get the expected wear out of them. This is my third
car with them and I've had to replace them at between 20-25K miles on all.
Mind you, they were't worn out at that mileage, but once you hit 1/2 of the
tread life on just about any Michelin, you will notice a dramatic decrease
in traction, especially in the rain or snow.
Click to expand...

That sounds about like the trajactory I'm on. I'm still hoping for 40K,
but I suspect I'll be lucky to get 30K.


Matt
 
That sounds about like the trajactory I'm on. I'm still hoping for
40K, but I suspect I'll be lucky to get 30K.


Matt
Click to expand...

On my last Elantra, at about 25k on the tires, we had a long dry spell.
The tires were still great until it rained. I almost lost control a few
times that day, but figured it was just all the oil on the road from
such a long dry spell. Three more good rain events and they were still
like driving on slicks. I bought a set of Dunlops that wore down to the
wear indicators (about 50,000 miles) and never had a problem like that.

Eric
 
I had a friend with a Honda Accord that had his oil changed at the dealer
and the gasket stayed on the engine. They didn't catch it and by the time
he got to work, the oil 'idiot' light came on due to lack of oil pressure.
The second gasket had blown out and dumped the oil. The dealer gave him an
extra 3 years warrantee on the engine.

Tom
 
I agree it doesn't affect the functionality of the filter that lost the
gasket, but it may affect the functionality of the next filter if this
isn't discovered. It is a failure and thus a quality lapse. I'm
curious now to see how often this happens. If it happens again, I'll
switch to NAPA or another filter brand whose quality I trust. But I
have a whole case of Hyundai filters so that will be a while, lost
gaskets or not!
Click to expand...

Therein lies the difference in how we look at these things. I look at that
issue as two separate parts that can come apart with no problem in my mind.
You see them as a quality problem. Two different perspectives. Both solved
by the same technique of paying attention to the job at hand.
 
Mike said:
Therein lies the difference in how we look at these things. I look at that
issue as two separate parts that can come apart with no problem in my mind.
You see them as a quality problem. Two different perspectives. Both solved
by the same technique of paying attention to the job at hand.
Click to expand...

Having worked in a Fortune 500 company for many moons and growing up
with TQM, this is easily a quality problem. Quality is defined by most
quality professionals as "meeting the requirements." I'm not aware of
any requirement for an oil filter to leave its gasket behind on the
engine. Very few parts are designed to come apart during or after use.

Since I'm pretty sure this oil filter wasn't designed to leave its
gasket on the engine, when it does so, that is a failure.

Whether a failure of a part causes a greater failure of another part
isn't relevant to whether the first part has experienced a failure or
not. I agree that it is easy to mitigate the filter failure with some
careful attention, but that doesn't change the face that the Hyundai
filter failed.


Matt
 
Matt said:
Having worked in a Fortune 500 company for many moons and growing up
with TQM, this is easily a quality problem. Quality is defined by most
quality professionals as "meeting the requirements." I'm not aware of
any requirement for an oil filter to leave its gasket behind on the
engine. Very few parts are designed to come apart during or after use.

Since I'm pretty sure this oil filter wasn't designed to leave its
gasket on the engine, when it does so, that is a failure.

Whether a failure of a part causes a greater failure of another part
isn't relevant to whether the first part has experienced a failure or
not. I agree that it is easy to mitigate the filter failure with some
careful attention, but that doesn't change the face that the Hyundai
filter failed.
Click to expand...

Considering that you're the only person who has reported this here or on
any of the forums, it's probably an isolated incident. Did you remember
to oil the seal before you installed the filter?
 
Yes, I'm surprised also as I've had exceptional mileage in the past from
Michelins.
Click to expand...

I usually get 40K from my truck tires. I recently noticed my last set was
50% worn after 5K! I examined the tires closely, there were a bazillion
micro-cuts. I figure it's from frequently traveling a certain road that was
recently re-surfaced with small, sharp gravel. I'll be staying off of that
road for a couple of years until it breaks in! :)
 
Brian Nystrom, on a thread about a gasket (o-ring) on a spin-on oil filter,
that got left behind on an engine, and caused problems when a 2nd oil filter
and gasket was installed, asked: "Did you remember to oil the seal before
you installed the filter?"......

You hit on it Brian. Over the course of years, I have had several of those
rubber o-rings that have fallen off the brand new oil filter as I was taking
them out of the boxes. I really do not know how well they are initially
placed onto the filter (or how well they are supposed to be). I have just
'laid' them back in there and it seems to be fine.

But in each case, I have put a film of oil on the o-ring before I put (spin)
the filter into place. Every time, that has done the trick, and the o-ring
and filter come off just fine and together. In fact, now that it has been
mentioned here, I realize that this little trick must work extremely well,
because although they have fallen off for me coming out of the box, I have
never even had to think about the o-ring still being on the engine filter
mount after they have been removed.

Clearly some of the filter companies are thinking about making sure they
come off though. Some of the better filters have the o-rings coated with
PTFE (think Slick 50). But it could be that this is for the percentage of
people who don't put a film of oil on their filter o-rings (there must be at
least some who don't). In my world, I don't see it as needed.

I do agree that doing the job right helps make sure that can't happen. When
my filters are off, I am inspecting and cleaning the engine filter mounting
base, wiping off oil, checking its condition, etc. If the o-ring stayed
behind, I just can't believe that between seeing that it is not on the
filter I just took off and seeing that it is on the base I am cleaning that
I could ever miss that - it is just too obvious.

So, in my world, this is not a manufacturing defect. It is simply a sloppy
(and downright inexcusable) job by the person who changed the oil. In that
sense, what the dealership did (the extended warranty) was probably
appropriate.

I will say that, when I was a teenager, I had my oil changed once by a
garage. This was one of those old-style cartridge types. Along with the
filter came an o-ring. But replacing it was a separate and much more
tedious process, and I think most people just threw those away.

But the owner of this garage surmised that the filter maker must want you to
replace it or they wouldn't have included it in the package. So he always
did. At the particualar time my oil was changed, one of his workers, a
young man who went to my church, did the oil change.

Sadly, he also added the new gasket without taking the old one out. I
spotted the stream of oil in my driveway and even followed it a quarter mile
down the road, and realized something was very wrong. I called the garage,
filled the car with oil, got it back there and fixed, and all was well. The
worker was fired.

I wonder if the worker who did this to this man's car suffered the same
fate, since this was much easier to do and see than what happened to my
fellow church-mate??

Tom Wenndt
 
It's been my experience that the original factory filter leaves its gasket
with a much higher frequencey than any installed later. I suspect it has
something to do with surface preparation and how tightly the filter is
installed (originals are rather tight).

You'll notice your new oil filters have a clear plastic covering over one
end. More freqently, I encounter the gasket sticking to the plastic, so
when you take it off, make sure the gasket is still positioned properly
before installing the filter on the car.
 
Mr. Hyundaitech, this just begs a question.

It was through the owner's (or service) manual of car after car I have owned
that I learned how badly oil filters and oil drain plugs were being
overtightened.

If the manufacturers set the tightening specs, why do they not adhere to
them? Indeed, every new vehicle I have ever owned has had both tightened
plug and filter even tighter then they are left after a fast oil change -
and that's saying something.

In my world, either the specs mean something or they don't. What am I
missing here?

Tom Wenndt
 
Sadly, I don't think you're missing anything. Most likely, the
manufacturer has more important places to concentrate their resources
unless this constant overtightening actually results in physical problems.


You'd think that with computerized robotic assembly plants, they'd be able
to control something like this very well. What's worse is that you're
right. The factory will put the oil filter on tighter than some monkey
who thinks he needs to put it on as tight as he can with a wrench so it
cannot come off.
 
Brian said:
Considering that you're the only person who has reported this here or on
any of the forums, it's probably an isolated incident. Did you remember
to oil the seal before you installed the filter?
Click to expand...

Absolutely. I'm hoping it is an isolated incident also. Time will tell.

Matt
 
hyundaitech said:
It's been my experience that the original factory filter leaves its gasket
with a much higher frequencey than any installed later. I suspect it has
something to do with surface preparation and how tightly the filter is
installed (originals are rather tight).
Click to expand...

In my case it was the third filter that lost its gasket. The original
filter came off at 2,500 miles and the second one came off at 5,000
miles. The third one came off at 10,000 miles, but left its gasket
behind. It is the first filter than I have run for 5,000 miles.


Matt
 
Matt, glad to see you made it to 10k with the clunk in the rear and the
sloshing gas, poor AC and the...I'm forgetting something!.........jsut
giving you a hard time, its HOT here. I have Michelin Pilots with 23,000
miles and they look great(2 rotations thus far). The oil filter gasket has
been something that can be problematic-has been so for years on any brand as
I'm sure you know-that why crafstmanship in the simplest of functions is
important-Dis not the grease monkey.....nice mpg for you, I can't manage
that on average with my 6, but can approach your number with careful highway
driving......
darby '06 sonata v6 23k miles....no problems what so ever thus far.
Cheers...PS Penn is a beautiful state, drove thru it last summer.
 
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