Hyundais cost/car versus The Big 3 American Car Manufacturers

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by Dave in Lake Villa, Jul 2, 2006.

  1. Interesting article in "Michigan Today" from the University of Michigan.
    According to Walter McManus, Director of the Uof M Transportation
    Research Institute, Automotive Analysis Division.

    The following excerpts are eye opening;
    Ford, GM and Chrysler spend $2903 per car on labor alone, Hyundai spends
    $551. Hyundais retirement expenses are $24 per vehicle, while the big
    3's cost $411 per vehicle. Big 3 health care cost is $1280 per vehicle,
    Hyundai's is $27 per vehicle. Likewise Japanese health care and pension
    costs are a fraction of what their American competitors pay.
    Dave in Lake Villa, Jul 2, 2006
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  2. Dave in Lake Villa

    Matt Whiting Guest

    Yes, and the Japanese and Koreans who manufacture in the US will
    eventually begin to have some of these problems also. They simply don't
    have the large "tail" of retirees that the longer standing US companies
    have here in the US. However, I'm not sure that the US automakers will
    survive long enough for this to affect their competitors and return the
    playing a little towards level. However, you will see the cost of
    Hyundai's climb as their costs increase as well.

    Matt Whiting, Jul 2, 2006
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  3. Dave in Lake Villa

    Jack Cassidy Guest

    The same thing killed the steel industry in this country, High union wages
    and benefits. I think most of the Korean cars produced in the U.S will
    probably be in the traditionally non-union south.
    Jack Cassidy, Jul 2, 2006
  4. Dave in Lake Villa

    James Guest

    That's what they'd like you to think, and they've done a good job
    getting a lot of people to believe it.

    The major factor that has hurt American manufacturing is not unions,
    pensions, labor cost or healthcare. In reality it is our government's
    unwillingness to insist on a level playing field with our trading
    partners. We allow free trade even though our partners choose to not
    abide by similar environmental regulations, overtime, labor rules,
    social security, safety regulations, and so on.

    We can de-unionize every job in America and we still cannot compete
    with Asia because they don't abide by the same rules as we do. If the
    government were to have some backbone and say, no more free trade until
    you treat the environment and your workers better, only then could we
    hope to compete with them.
    James, Jul 3, 2006
  5. Dave in Lake Villa

    Rob Guest

    So you want the U.S. Government to TELL other industries in other countries
    how much to pa their workers? What kind of benefits to give their workers?
    Like it our not the U.S. high standard of living created high wages, now
    other Countries have the capability to compete without the expense. In time
    as their standard of living increases so will the cost of business.
    Rob, Jul 3, 2006
  6. Dave in Lake Villa

    Jack Cassidy Guest

    The only problem with your theory is the rust belt Northeast part of this
    country became the rustbelt before the free trade agreements. Companies like
    Mack Truck left Pennsylvania to move down south, not out of the country. The
    problem remains today, The south has always had lower non-union wages. Do
    the foreign auto makers that produce cars in this country have UAW workers?
    Then we have things like the Overseas Private Investment Corporation (OPIC)
    that guarantee companies that move out of the US to banana republics that
    they will not lose money if nationalized by these governments. We are
    literally guaranteeing the success of companies that leave here and put
    Americans out of work.
    I don't know what the solution is, I don't think de-unionizing all jobs is
    the answer nor is protectionism.
    Unions were in large part responsible for creation of the middle class in
    this country, but the management decided they would rather rob the union
    members than protect them. And if we protect our industries from foreign
    competition we end up with products that nobody wants, Remember the junk
    Detroit produced in the 70's and 80's? Toyota was a wake up call.
    Jack Cassidy
    Jack Cassidy, Jul 3, 2006
  7. Dave in Lake Villa

    Matt Whiting Guest

    It's already happening. I've read two articles in the last couple of
    months about China outsourcing to other countries such as Vietnam as
    their labor costs are getting too high. :)

    What goes around, comes around.

    Matt Whiting, Jul 3, 2006
  8. Dave in Lake Villa

    Vineeth Guest

    It is the same in all industries! The IT field is seeing jobs
    outsourced to Bangalore in India outsourced to places like China.
    Infact giants like Infosys already have their own centers in China
    Vineeth, Jul 3, 2006
  9. Dave in Lake Villa

    nothermark Guest

    If you want to pick Unions to go after it's the public employee
    unions. They get their raises, paid benefits and more holidays than I
    can name but the manufacturing sector get's the bill. NY is the
    leader in this but seveal other states are not far behind.
    manufactuing wages have been on a steady decline as jobs left but
    government wages (direct and indirect) have been growing at more than
    the inflation rate. The result has been taxes growng at more than the
    inflation rate and the greying of the state as the early to mid career
    workers leave.
    nothermark, Jul 3, 2006
  10. Dave in Lake Villa

    Bob Adkins Guest


    Unfortunately, NY can't close up shop and move down South. Even if they
    could, nobody would want them. :)

    All kidding aside, if the unions keep growing, we are heading more and more
    toward a French-like society. <shudder!>
    Bob Adkins, Jul 4, 2006
  11. Dave in Lake Villa

    Jack Cassidy Guest


    I can see you've never been to Spring Hill, Florida. <g>
    Just about everyone there is either from New York or Michigan, Especially
    during the winter months.
    Hell, at least they're not Canadians

    Jack Cassidy
    Jack Cassidy, Jul 4, 2006
  12. Dave in Lake Villa

    nothermark Guest

    that will taper off also. As the economy continues to collapse fewer
    folks will be retiring from NY so they won't be going places to
    nothermark, Jul 6, 2006
  13. Dave in Lake Villa

    KWW Guest

    Greed is a big factor too. Often CEOs come in to "fix" companies, but in
    reality just make them profitible for the short term. In the '70s US Steel
    turned a healthy profit for one quarter by selling their next-generation
    steel making technology to Japanese firms.... not long thereafter, Japanese
    steel went from a crappy cheap alternative (used in cars like the Pintos of
    the early '70s) to cheaper AND better quality than US steel.

    Basically we seem to be willing to sacrifice long-term sustainable growth
    for quick "get rich" returns. As a result, we are bankrupting our nation's
    future. Well, most of those bastards will be dead by the time the US
    collapses into a 3rd world country, so what do they care?
    KWW, Jul 8, 2006
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