Motor Trend Azera

  • Thread starter Thread starter Deck
  • Start date Start date
Reply to message from "Darby OGill" <[email protected]> (Fri, 09 Mar 2007 11:
08:12) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

DO> Matt, Ed, Wayne........a few words defending Buick

No need to defend Buick, Darby. To each his own. There are people who like
Buicks and there are people who like other cars.

However you have to understand that for years on end Hyundai owners have
had to bear all sorts of insults against the cars they chose to buy -
insults that in a way also insulted the intelligence of the owners for
having bought a Hyundai.

It therefore is poetic justice when Hyundai is showing up the 'all holy
GM'. You could do no wrong if you bought a GM / Ford / Chrysler vehicle -
any model. But to buy a Hyundai .... you must be an idiot, they would
surely think if not say.

DO> Have you driven (or owned) a Buick a lately? I previously had a '99
DO> Regal LSE. I loved it.

I had a rental 2000 Buick Century and it was OK if you like a couch in
wheels. The demographic are older folks and they deserve to get a nice soft
cushy floaty Buick because they like that sort of ride.

DO> .......I love my Sonata. If it turns out be as good as the Buick, it
DO> will have been a great car too.

I am sure that it will be just as dependable as a current Buick would be. I
say that because all makers are faced with the challenge of offering more
sophistication features and performance for less cost, and sometimes
reliability suffers when compared with older simpler models.

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:03:57 -0600

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
Reply to message from "Edwin Pawlowski" <[email protected]> (Fri, 09 Mar 2007
12:00:44) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

EP> 84 and 91 Regals, 97 and 01 LeSabres. Still have the 01 LeSabre. Olds,
EP> 81, 83, 86.

EP> My experience with the 01 LeSabre is why I bought a Hyundai.

Hehehe .... Good post Ed. You are certainly eminently qualified by both
your purchases and your experiences.

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:31:08 -0600

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
Reply to message from "Darby OGill" <[email protected]> (Fri, 09 Mar 2007 17:
00:31) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

DO> .. PS If you put the Volvo seats, and the Buick headroom/seating
DO> position in the Sonata, I'd never look back......
DO> maybe thats where the Azera come in.

I believe you are right. Based on my experience with the Azera and compared
to my Tiburon, the Azera is what today's Buick should be striving towards.

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:36:15 -0600

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
Reply to message from "Darby OGill" <[email protected]> (Fri, 09 Mar 2007 11:
08:12) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":


However you have to understand that for years on end Hyundai owners have
had to bear all sorts of insults against the cars they chose to buy -
insults that in a way also insulted the intelligence of the owners for
having bought a Hyundai.
Click to expand...


That's an interesting thought Wayne. As one who waited a long time to buy a
Hyundai, I owned several GM's while I watched Hyundai develop. A friend had
purchased a Hyundai in the early 90's and had some good luck with the car.
It had some problems, but it was a fairly new introduction at the time and
some problems were to be expected. The car did show promise though, and it
was an interesting car to watch develop. It wasn't something I was ready to
invest any money in though, until the early 2000 era vehicles came along. I
started looking pretty closely at them in the early 2000's and finally
bought a 2004 Sonata. Never looked back. I'm still GM at heart and I'm one
of the crowd that is hoping they'll get past their arrogance and mis-deeds
of the past and get back to building the quality they've been known for and
creating a new customer care attitude, but this Sonata has really impressed
me. I never did look down my nose at any Hyundai owner. Always thought
they were taking some pretty big chances on that company in the early days,
but that's not a look down on cause in my book.
It therefore is poetic justice when Hyundai is showing up the 'all holy
GM'. You could do no wrong if you bought a GM / Ford / Chrysler vehicle -
any model. But to buy a Hyundai .... you must be an idiot, they would
surely think if not say.
Click to expand...

Oh - let me correct you there Wayne. It has always been... Ford owners were
to be somewhat pitied for their dimwitedness, or perhaps their economic
misfortune as to be unable to afford a nice car. Chrsyler owners were just
despicable.


DO> .......I love my Sonata. If it turns out be as good as the Buick, it
DO> will have been a great car too.
I am sure that it will be just as dependable as a current Buick would be. I
say that because all makers are faced with the challenge of offering more
sophistication features and performance for less cost, and sometimes
reliability suffers when compared with older simpler models.
Click to expand...

My wife's 04 is creeping up on 60K miles, even as we speak. I have not put
a wrench to the car except to change the oil. I'll be changing the timing
belt soon and the associated preventative tasks, and I'm still not thrilled
at having to do that, but it's life with rubber band interference engines.
Certainly not unique to Hyundai. That is a pretty good reliability record
in my book. And I have to say... every time I get into that car and drive
it, I get out saying the same damned thing - "man this car impresses me".
My wife just loves that car as much today as the day we bought it.
 
Reply to message from "Mike Marlow" <[email protected]> (Sun, 11 Mar 2007
06:10:25) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

MM> As one who waited a long time to buy a Hyundai, I owned several GM's

That is one domestic brand I have not bought and that is largely due to 2
main reasons - (1) their styling (to my taste) was a joke and (2) they
apparently had this arrogant corporate mindset to continue building the
cars they did without listening to the consumer and changing with the
times. It is as if they decided "whatever we decide to build the customer
will buy because we are GM". It is only when the American consumer started
getting smarter and stopped buying cars essentially solely on brand loyalty
that they started to listen. Now they are still shi**ing bricks as they
bleed money all over the place. Now they are starting to make charges in
style and quality. Question is - are they too late...?

MM> while I watched Hyundai develop. A friend had purchased a Hyundai in
MM> the early 90's and had some good luck with the car. It had some
MM> problems, but it was a fairly new introduction at the time and some
MM> problems were to be expected.

I have bought 5 Hyundais since 1989. Do I think they are the best cars in
the world? No. Best quality? No. Best looking? Not really. My 1989 Sonata
was pretty ugly with its flat-top rear wheel arches. That car was also
always needing to have suspension bushings changed to correct clunking. It
was reliable but inexpensive. It did have the best warranty available at
the time and the repairs cost me nothing. They were done cheerfully with
little argument.

When I was buying the car I traded a Ford Tempo with low mileage and in
excellent shape. I first went to the Ford dealership thinking of getting a
Taurus since my Tempo was excellent for me. The salesman didn't even want
to look at me because I still owed in the Tempo. He lost my business in 5
minutes. Never went back.

Went to GM and Chrysler for a look. Their salesmen also had this air of
superiority as if I pulled up to do them a favour that day. Ignoring them I
looked at the cars. What a joke. Warranty was basic, quality of fit and
finish was a joke (ever run your eye along the side or along a feature line
form panel to panel? Scary!), and the price was not that good for what they
were peddling.

Went to Honda, Nissan, Toyota and 'this Hyundai place' down the road. While
the Japanese cars were all many notches above the domestics, the Accord was
the closest to what I wanted in terms of quality, performance and styling.
All of the dealers were friendly and attentive and wanted to sell me a car,
even if they wanted to give me a joke for my trade.

Then I went to the Hyundai dealer. Not only was the performance better than
the Accord but they gave more on the trade, the car cost 15% less for the
same feature set, and the warranty was better. Fit and finish was between
the Japanese and the domestics. Despite the hated flat-top rear wheel arch
I bought the car. While it was perfectly reliable for me, the quality
issues made it the worse Hyundai I ever owned.

So why did I go back to Hyundai for my 1993, 1995 and 2002 Elantras, and my
2005 Tiburon? For the same reasons most Hyundai owners buy their Hyundais -
bang for buck, i.e. that elusive balance of lower price, features, warranty
and especially in latter years, quality and styling. I personally have a
couple more reasons - reliability (never had a breakdown) and before AND
after sales service.

That said other car makers are adopting the Hyundai formula and at the same
time Hyundai is raising prices. That is better for the consumer but could
be bad for Hyundai.

MM> back. I'm still GM at heart

I am Mercedes Benz and Aston Martin at heart but as I dream I am (so far)
Hyundai in reality. That said I am very partial to the only GM would love
to buy now - the Chevy Corvette Z06 - bang for buck supercar.

MM> and I'm
MM> one of the crowd that is hoping they'll get past their arrogance and
MM> mis- deeds of the past and get back to building the quality they've
MM> been known for and creating a new customer care attitude,

Hear hear!

MM> Hyundai owner. Always thought they were taking some pretty big chances
MM> on that company in the early days,

You bet we were. But look at what that said about the domestics - we'd
rather buy a pig in a poke than buy your crap and that while we suffer
'altitude' from the sales and service departments!

MM> Oh - let me correct you there Wayne. It has always been... Ford owners
MM> were to be somewhat pitied for their dimwitedness, or perhaps their
MM> economic misfortune as to be unable to afford a nice car. Chrsyler
MM> owners were just despicable.

Ha ha ha .... my only Ford was very good to me but my current 1996 Dodge
minivan is basically garbage. Only has just over 106 k miles but the number
of things that had to be replaced is too long to mention. The only way I
will darken the door of a Dodge dealer again is if Hyundai owns it. ;-)

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sun, 11 Mar 2007 10:58:42 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
Mike Marlow said:
That's an interesting thought Wayne. As one who waited a long time to buy
a
Hyundai, I owned several GM's while I watched Hyundai develop. A friend
had
purchased a Hyundai in the early 90's and had some good luck with the car.
It had some problems, but it was a fairly new introduction at the time and
some problems were to be expected. The car did show promise though, and
it
was an interesting car to watch develop.
Click to expand...


I didn't watch it develop; I just ignored it. Had I not has problems with my
Buick, I may have continued to ignore it and just bought another Buick. .
My former impression was that they rusted away (early ones did), were too
small, lacked any special styling appeal. Once I took the time to look at
them closely, then actually drive one, I was impressed. Styling got my eye
with the Tiburon, then the new Sonata and Azera.

If Hyundai could take a bunch of them out and get people off the street to
drive one, I'd bet there sales would jump. Go to the supermarket parking
lot, the mall, the little league field, grab the driver and entice him to
take a new model out around the parking lot and I'd bet many would be
hooked. Lots of bang for the buck.

I'm looking forward to the new model in two years. It will really give
Buick and Avalon a run.
 
Reply to message from "Edwin Pawlowski" <[email protected]> (Sun, 11 Mar 2007
14:38:11) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

EP> appeal. Once I took the time to look at them closely, then actually
EP> drive one, I was impressed.

At the risk of being accused again of plugging my website, the above
comment is essentially the reason behind the website's name - Drivers and
Believers.

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sun, 11 Mar 2007 17:43:14 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
Reply to message from Matt Whiting <[email protected]> (Sun, 11 Mar 2007 16:
09:30) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

MW> Deck wrote:

MW> I can read them just fine.

Same here.

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sun, 11 Mar 2007 17:47:44 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
At the risk of being accused again of plugging my website, the above
comment is essentially the reason behind the website's name - Drivers and
Believers.


I never saw it. Until now that I did a Google search Why not just put
http://egt.gwebworks.com/index.shtml in your sig line? Anyone curious will
click on it.
 
Reply to message from "Edwin Pawlowski" <[email protected]> (Sun, 11 Mar
2007 14:38:11) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

EP> appeal. Once I took the time to look at them closely, then
actually EP> drive one, I was impressed.

At the risk of being accused again of plugging my website, the above
comment is essentially the reason behind the website's name - Drivers
and Believers.

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sun, 11 Mar 2007 17:43:14 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
Click to expand...

Have you no shame man!!! :-)

Eric
 
Reply to message from "Eric G." <[email protected]> (Sun, 11
Mar 2007 18:45:20) about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

EG> Have you no shame man!!! :-)

Hahaha ..... funneee ... :-)

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Sun, 11 Mar 2007 21:37:35 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
would you please interpret thjis for me then?
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=

Doesn't make any sense to me!!
 
this is what the entire post looks like. but wh Motor Trend Azera
"Deck" <deca 2007-03-08 11:47:00
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Edwin Pawlowski&quo 2007-03-08 20:28:48
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Deck" <deca 2007-03-08 16:13:16
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-08 18:44:37
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Edwin Pawlowski&quo 2007-03-09 02:37:12
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-10 20:51:12
Re: Motor Trend Azera
Matt Whiting <whiting@ 2007-03-08 23:06:49
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Darby OGill" & 2007-03-09 17:08:12
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Edwin Pawlowski&quo 2007-03-09 18:00:44
Re: Motor Trend Azera
Matt Whiting <whiting@ 2007-03-09 20:49:12
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Darby OGill" & 2007-03-09 23:00:31
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Mike Marlow" & 2007-03-09 19:20:40
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-10 21:50:03
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-10 21:50:01
Re: Motor Trend Azera
Matt Whiting <whiting@ 2007-03-09 20:47:12
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Mike Marlow" & 2007-03-09 19:28:20
Re: Motor Trend Azera
Matt Whiting <whiting@ 2007-03-10 00:58:16
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Mike Marlow" & 2007-03-09 19:15:53
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"What" <that 2007-03-10 18:34:31
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Rob" <bucfa 2007-03-11 01:57:40
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-10 21:50:00
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Mike Marlow" & 2007-03-11 06:10:25
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-11 12:14:16
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Edwin Pawlowski&quo 2007-03-11 19:38:11
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-11 17:53:42
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Edwin Pawlowski&quo 2007-03-11 23:43:02
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Eric G." <N 2007-03-11 23:45:20
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-11 21:43:52
Re: Motor Trend Azera
Brian Nystrom <brian.n 2007-03-09 00:52:19
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-10 20:51:14
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
"Deck" <deca 2007-03-11 15:31:56
Re: Motor Trend Azera
Matt Whiting <whiting@ 2007-03-11 21:09:30
=?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
Wayne Moses <wmoses@[E 2007-03-11 17:53:43
Re: Motor Trend Azera

en I click on the garbage, I get nothing!!
 
Deck said:
this is what the entire post looks like. but wh Motor Trend Azera
"Deck" <deca 2007-03-08 11:47:00
Re: Motor Trend Azera
"Edwin Pawlowski&quo 2007-03-08 20:28:48
Click to expand...


Either your news server is cutting stuff or your news reader is messing up.
They've been reading fine here.
 
Guess it really doesn't make any difference. only the ones from Wayne Moses
show up that way: =?Windows-1252?Q?Re=3A=20Motor=20Trend=20Azera?=
and when I click on it, it shows the same thing!!
 
Reply to message from "Deck" <[email protected]> (Tue, 13 Mar 2007 16:58:26)
about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

D> Guess it really doesn't make any difference. only the ones from Wayne
D> Moses show up that way

Hmmmm..... they look fine on my PC and Pocket PC. Anyone else have problems
reading my posts?

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Tue, 13 Mar 2007 18:18:16 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
 
Wayne said:
Reply to message from "Deck" <[email protected]> (Tue, 13 Mar 2007 16:58:26)
about "Re: Motor Trend Azera":

D> Guess it really doesn't make any difference. only the ones from Wayne
D> Moses show up that way

Hmmmm..... they look fine on my PC and Pocket PC. Anyone else have problems
reading my posts?

Best Regards
Wayne Moses <[email protected]> Tue, 13 Mar 2007 18:18:16 -0500

=== Posted with Qusnetsoft NewsReader 3.3
Click to expand...

No, I see them fine.

Matt
 
Mike Marlow said:
Hmmmm..... they look fine on my PC and Pocket PC. Anyone else have
problems
reading my posts?


Nope.
Click to expand...

To give you an idea of how perfect the newsgroup system is, Mike's message
show that it is not even going to be send until 9:22 AM but I'm able to read
it at 9:08AM. Algore did a great job on this.
 
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